Help decide my map's features (Yet another MC map post)

Discussion in 'TTT Discussion' started by SquidgyBoat, Sep 14, 2020 at 9:15 PM.

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What do you like in a TTT map?

  1. T Tester

    48.4%
  2. Big / Good T room

    61.3%
  3. Lots of T Traps

    45.2%
  4. Only a few T traps

    41.9%
  5. Close quarters mostly

    3.2%
  6. Long distance mostly

    9.7%
  7. A good mix between long and short distance encounters

    87.1%
  8. Smaller map

    12.9%
  9. Bigger map

    58.1%
  10. Inno win puzzle

    41.9%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. SquidgyBoat

    SquidgyBoat The Admiral Moderator VIP

    So, with all this talk from Vader recently about making MC maps, it got me thinking about how I used to dabble in hammer editor trying to make TTT or other Gmod maps.

    I'm gonna try and make one in java, port it with sourcecraft to hammer, and make a new TTT map for the server.

    I've been building the map area for the last day or so, and I'm nearing completion on it in java. Before I port, I wanted to ask you guys for input.

    What things do you hate about maps in the current rotation? What do you want to see more of?

    Please post below what makes a map great, and what makes it shit. If your idea is implemented I'll include your user in that obnoxious and presumptuous signature room mappers make.

     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Dodley27

    Dodley27 Dolfin VIP Bronze

    Why did you tag me I have no idea how to make maps
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  3. -Vader-

    -Vader- VIP

    I think the best way to do this is... pick a game you enjoy, and make a map based on that game. You want to make a map YOU want to play, not what OTHERS want to play. After you make the actual map, you can then implement all the additional things like traps, etc. It doesn't matter how shit it is, experience is experience, and who knows, people might enjoy it. The more experience you have, the more little things you can do with hammer.
    Marshal might have some points. There is a reason why most maps are SQUARE, so there is not a lot of texturing you can do. The more textures you add (detailing), the more you'll lag. You can make your own textures and combine two or more of them together. Instead of making like a rectangle and then up and down border, you could literally have ONE texture and it will make the border and the wall. I don't do this, because I am rushing my maps. I also don't port my maps, I make them by hand, even if I do make them in Minecraft. The next map I am working on, I didn't make it in Minecraft, but I have a ruler mod in Gmod.
    If there are more questions, try asking marshal, maybe he can help you.

    I had marshal when I needed help, but there are tutorials you can watch and do what marshal does. I haven't looked at a single tutorial, because I got a great source.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Aquast

    Aquast lordy was here :sneaky: VIP Bronze

    Make sure there are some inreachable areas, I love 'em
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  5. Spooky Adult

    Spooky Adult Now you just somebody that I used to know VIP Silver

    No testers and it's a good map
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  6. Wolfy53

    Wolfy53 VIP

    In my opinion here are a few things I like in the current maps

    -T Traps - Sword on jondome. Pit trap on office for two reasons, instakill and teleports traitors to t room if jumped in. Anything that is an obvious explosive prop that can be moved to a strategic location and activated by the traitors manually. The small spot on jondome that allows you to hide a C4.

    I'm not a big fan of fixed explosive areas because all that does is make people not play on that part of the map since they know it is almost certain death there. Unless the explosives can be triggered by shooting them to get rid of the danger. We all know people like blowing shit up for no reason.

    -Size/Location - My ideal map size is something like richland where there is outside, inside, and underground areas without too much surface are that makes it so big that you can't find shit without a radar. A mix between nuketown and richland would be a cool idea where you have 2 opposing sides with high areas, a decent amount of cover in the middle, and some defensive areas too. You just need to make it big enough to snipe without having too much of an advantage while not being small enough to kill everyone with just a few well placed C4

    -T Rooms - Having a map with a T room is always good. I am a big fan of the t rooms that have teleporters in them that connect all the rooms. Maybe put some buttons in the room that controls environmental stuff like flooding the bathroom or like on lego with the vehicles that crash and explode. Something I really enjoy is when there is a permanent change to the map as a result of a T trap. I know that contradicts what i said earlier about fixed explosive areas but on lego you have time to react to it. Maybe a bomb that puts a big hole in the map or opens a new area. I love blowing up the pipe on canyon and flooding the map. This is a really good way to flush people out into the open in order to force the round to end quicker.

    -T Testers - I have always been a proponent of having to find a randomly spawning item to activate the tester and the tester not being instant. Having a certain amount of times it can be used it good too. Making it so you can destroy it is something I feel is necessary Also. If you have to find something to activate it then it getting destroyed pre-round will be almost impossible.

    -Innocent Win Puzzle - I have always liked this idea. I'm not sure how you would implement it without it feeling like it is forced. B5 does it pretty well but I don't know how you would make it feel normal in any other application. It would depend entirely on the map being made. I really like the black mesa puzzle that lets the traitors win. As far as I can tell none of the minecraft maps do this, at least not the ones I play.

    Something else I like is the puzzle that opens a secret room where you can get a knife. Just don't put in special music for obtaining it like on a couple of the modded maps. That shit ain't cool.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Creative Creative x 1
  7. PROPS PROPS PROPS PROPS. Give something for spectators to mess with. Give something for innos to RDM with. ( ͡ʘ ͜ʖ ͡ʘ)
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. Lordyhgm

    Lordyhgm The person below me smells Lead Admin VIP

    So I don't know much at all about map making, but I can give some player and staff perspective

    Testers:
    - Testers that need two people aren't often used. The tester on mc_city requires 3 and the once in a blue moon it gets used the result is confusing to casual players and it just traps the poor sods in it who get C4'ed, no fun and functionally redundant.
    - An activation item gives innocents to move around and explore
    - A breakable tester adds an objective to any traitors and opens up gameplay opportunities.
    - An easy to break tester will rarely make it into the round to be used, but one that takes a few more hits gives plenty of time to be saved and used.
    - If there's gonna be a kill button a cancel function is preferable, especially if it's also going to have a T trap to fake the result. This is from a staffing perspective, any map that has the above will have at least one report about it > the features are great and interesting to use, just please make the kills credit the button pusher/T trap activator to help ease it x

    Space:
    - Bright maps are generally better, there are notable exceptions, but of all the most played and enjoyed maps the overwhelming majority are well lit or have good contrast between players and background
    - I don't suffer from claustrophobia but a small and very close quarters map is oppressive and puts a player on edge. Thankfully, it's a very easy thing to remedy, with wider/longer corridors, open areas, and frequent rooms or areas. Maps like Dolls and Motel manage to balance out their respective close and open styles very well and so remain popular despite cries to play literally anything else
    - Easy access to everywhere helps the game flow and rounds be interesting (+ less delay)
    - Small maps are often less popular, whether that's due to fewer things to do, more difficult T rounds, or great pretensity to get stale idk.
    - Large maps are more likely to favour traitors as crowds and witnesses are less likely, and so balance with fewer T Traps or exclusive areas.

    T traps:
    - Avoidable T traps are more fun for everyone. Think Skycraft creeper trap vs community pool flood, insta-death with no advance warning and a ludicrous hit box vs plenty of time to react, teleport out, or come to terms with your fate and learn from the death. If you miss someone with a T trap then you can walk away and get better at the timings or baiting.
    - Having some form of alert that a T trap is being used helps alleviate issues with killing buddies.
    - T traps that don't credit kills are the source of a lot of false reports or agitated players.

    Secrets/conditional events:
    - Adds new and interesting dynamics and gameplay
    - Can keep things fresh with not every round ending in 1v1 etc
    - A range of difficulties is preferable, something like community bowling knife is done ~once per map, same as community pool, life the roof etc, seriouscraft might have the knife done 2 or 3 times a cycle, and 67thway once every few times the map is picked (since it's so large and difficult to achieve within a normal round). Something that is satisfying to complete, reasonably easy to figure out, possible do in an average round, and (most importantly) easy to teach to a new player. I find half the fun of doing a puzzle is then teaching someone else to do it the next round, and I know that's a sentiment many share and helps create engagement in the maps.

    + possessable props
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2020 at 11:22 AM
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. SquidgyBoat

    SquidgyBoat The Admiral Moderator VIP

    I agree with a lot of what @Wolfy53 and @Lordyhgm said, and I'm glad because the map I've built so far incorporates much of what they're talking about.

    Before I tackle making a tester, I want to port over my MC map to Hammer using Sourcecraft. For the life of me, I can't get the goddamn thing to port.

    EDIT:
    I've tried three versions of Sourcecraft, with the 2.1 version resulting in an empty skybox, and the 3.1 version not even compiling to begin with. I've been working on this for two days now. I wanted to see if I could get a viable prototype up and running before sharing the file with some of you, or posting a video of the map so far, but I am quickly losing my will to work on this now. @-Vader- I know you've said that you just use MC as a template and then build it from scratch in hammer, but I really don't have the time for that lol, especially when I've already modified the MC map so much to factor in conversion / TTT map restrictions.

    If anyone knows about this stuff, for the love of God please help me, I am at my wit's end with this. @Zuijj

    I've followed this video to a tee, changing little things in hopes of making it work like he does, to no avail.
    Problem is, I can't use my map I've been working on. So, time to start anew. I'll be keeping all these things in mind though.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2020 at 5:16 PM