Completed Report against ryan and sticky bandit

Name of Staff/Player:

ryan and sticky bandit​

Steam ID of Staff/Player:

staff​

Your Steam ID:

not staff​

Which Server:

West 1​

Which Map:

ttt_shoutbox​

Which Round:

20​

Time of Occurence:

yesterday I think​

Reason For Report:

nigga is the colloquial term that has been used freely throughout SGM and was not introduced to the ruling when "nigger" was not allowed. This is a common phrase, and if it is being interpreted as racist, then sticky bandit is being racist in assuming that PiggyBlade intended to use the word in any type of racist, derogatory way.

edit: oh yeah. ryan too because he actually placed the ban. owo
​

Evidence And/Or Witnesses:

​

 

Tagging my lead @Teroxa, and @Sticky Bandit, and his admin @Temar

 

I guess add @Temar to this report as well?





I don't know what's going on...? Literally none of this is racist? The only person being racist is Temar in assuming that UncleBee was referring to his race? What the fuck is going on with you guys?

 

I issued my warning on TrinityBlade, triggering an auto-ban under the discretion of Ryan. I'm not using this as some sort of excuse, as I'm the one who asked if I could warn him in the first place.
I warned TrinityBlade for using slurs in Shoutbox. Racial slurs are prohibited. However, "nigga" isn't typically used a slur. It's just a colloquial term used commonly to describe friends, or just people in general. So, on SGM, we generally allow the use of the word "nigga", because there's usually no racial motivation behind it.
However, as it usually does, context matters. We do not allow racial or any group based slurs, therefore when someone uses a word we normally don't consider to be a slur as a slur, they have violated the rules. It's similar to when someone says "I'm going to say the N word!!", then someone else in chat says "Fuck neighbors!" Obviously neighbor isn't a slur, however the given context has changed it into one. This situation is quite similar to that, especially given the history of the word "nigga".
I'm not sure if you realize, but "nigga" is kind of a slang term for the hard-R N-bomb. Basically, it started off as the actual, hard R N-word. "nigga" and the real thing were interchangeable. Think about how a dude from Boston might say the N-bomb. Their accent is going to make it sound like "nigga". That ain't what they're saying, though. Somewhere in the 70s and 80s, the word "nigga" began to get satirized and turned into a symbol of pride for black people. Think about the rap group N.W.A., and some of their most controversial songs. The word "nigga" gained widespread use by people of all race somewhere in the 2000s, and now it's usually quite acceptable to say.
Now that we understand where the word "nigga" came from, we can begin discussing more into if this is an acceptable use case of "nigga", or an unacceptable way. This will require a lot of context for me to build my case, which is why I asked an admin before I made any action.

Spoilers below will be labeled according to the numbered point. All evidence will be attached down there.

1. Nigga Spotter. At some point, TrinityBlade renamed himself to "nigga spotter" on discord. At first, it didn't really seem like anything was going on. However, Trinity made it apparent that he meant "nigga spotter", as in "ni**er spotter", or "black spotter". The context given here has changed the the normal, un-racist term "nigga" into the hard-R racist version. Again, the word "nigga" is directly derived from "ni**er".
   
2. This forum post. The juxtaposition of a black guy eating a watermelon (A common stereotype), plus the use of the word "nigga" is racist. Why didn't I forum warn for that post? I was building a harder case. It's hard to count any "one-offs" for real action, as it could just be coincidence and my brain seeing shit different from how it is. However, I believe this was a racial use of the word, based upon all points presented in this list. You cannot count them individually, they must be treated as a group in order to build proper context and understand the reasoning for the official warning point.
3. "Ni**er Chains". Chains of the word "ni**er" being put on peoples profiles. The posts have since been deleted, however I have a screenshot of Trinity participating in the chains, both on Discord and on the Forums. Warning points were issued for these, so it's not as if Trinity was unaware he was doing anything wrong.
   
4. The Final Straw. Finally we arrive to the warning point issued. "stop being nigga and then u won't be discriminated against". The most heavily discriminated group has typically been the one to be called "niggas", "ni**ers", etc. So you can imagine how offensive it might seem to say something like this.

TrinityBlade has no plea to ignorance here. I've gathered 4 separate cases of racism. If you still think this is a false ban and that "nigga" is ok, I'll link a few videos that should give you an idea of how severe the word "nigga" can be, in certain contexts.

I've made my case, I'll let the admins do their thing now.

Spoiler: 1. Nigga Spotter

Spoiler: 3. Ni**er Chains

Spoiler: 4. The Final Straw

Helpful videos:
Where did the N-word come from?
How does the N-word make you feel?
Can White People Say The N Word? | LoveHate
"You are just a ni**er": children's reactions
The n-word through history

 

tldr; you're under the discretion of how staff understand / interpret your use of the n word, -er or -a.

 

what about my case, i wasnt being racist at all and yet hes making me look like one

 

Hey guys, please don't comment on this forum report unless you are the reported staff members, the reportee, or can contribute evidence to the case.

 

I'm not sure why you brought up a bunch of examples that didn't relate to the example I posted. I was reporting a specific instance where a user was banned that didn't contain any racist connotations.

I do feel that nigga is okay, and the community has determined that in the past. I don't know why you're posting your personal/political opinions when this is a thread about SGM's rules... Do we just ban people because they don't follow your own personal opinions/convictions now? Huh?

To be more clear.. can you tell me exactly in the "last straw" message what was racist? Or is it just racist because you determined that he is a racist?

 

If you have something to say that is RELEVANT to the report, message a staff member to unlock it.
Until then, locked since people are going to comment here to get warning points.

 

Hello neutral,
I gave @Sticky Bandit discretion to warn PiggyBlade after seeing the evidence presented to me and others by Sticky Bandit. The way PiggyBlade said it made me deem it as an attempt to be used in an offensive way to others.
Note the word nigga is allowed as long as it's not being used in a racist or offensive way to others.
Tagging @Teroxa for his verdict on this report.

 

Heya.

You can expect my verdict on this report soon.
I'm investigating and am currently in conversation with the people involved.
I'll conclude when I've finished my investigation and everyone has responded here.

~ Teroxa

 

Thread unlocked by request of @neutral. Remember guys, if you're not involved with the report, do not post. You will be issued warning points.

 

Thanks, Teroxa!

Before you conclude, there were a couple of questions I asked in my report that went unanswered that I would like addressed if possible.

1) Sticky Bandit has not replied to my response to his post. I would like to know specifically what in Trinity's last comment was specifically racist. I do understand that he is arguing that there is evidence that, in the past, Trinity has posted comments that do seem to be racist in nature. I don't disagree with the actions there. However, I don't see the bridge between what was posted previously, leaning in to the comment that he was most recently punished for. As you are aware, we don't consider previous actions as proof that a rule has been violated. Just because you were racist in the past, doesn't mean that you're being racist with every other instance of word "nigga" in the future- and that seems to be what's happening here.

2) As a reminder, this is also a report against Temar, and Temar has yet to reply to this report or my questions against him despite being active in the community elsewhere. I would like Temar specifically to explain what was racist in UncleBee's comments- as that one seems even more outrageous than what Sticky Bandit is claiming.

3) And.... this one is new, but as a continuation of the report against Sticky Bandit, I would like to know why he is participating in rating boosting. I didn't notice this until I went to shoot Sticky Bandit a message to unlock this thread. Evidence can be found in the following screenshots:

https://i.imgur.com/ng8nt0N.png
https://i.imgur.com/CnaDCQJ.png
https://i.imgur.com/ypINL2J.png
https://i.imgur.com/V62KUAX.png

Thanks again!

 

Here's some quick responses:

1) The reason I used previous examples was to "build a case". The reason I felt this was necessary is that a one off use of the word nigga in what could be a racist way might have just been an accident on Trinity's part, and something that might not even be there. However, when it happens repeatedly, it becomes apparent that it's no accident. Juxtaposition of the word nigga and some common stereotypes and statistics can, and is in this case, racist. Black dudes are historically most discrimated against - so when Trinity uses nigga to describe what someone shouldn't be in order to not be considered up for discrimination, it's quite clear there was a racial tie to the word. It's not the word alone - it's the juxtaposition.

3) My plan was to leave them up for a day, then go through and undo all the ratings. It's a bit of a gag between PixeL and I where we pretend to be madly in love (But let me be clear - it's a gag, there's no relationship), so when he jokingly asks for upvotes, me being the good husband and all, I upvote. Once again, the plan was to remove all the ratings in a day, as to not actually boost his positives in any meaningful way. This might sound kinda dumb, and it really is, but I didn't even know recent ratings and stuff like that showed up on profiles. If I knew the public eye could see our joke, I wouldn't have done it - because it would look real bad, set a poor example,and they'd have no way of knowing I would be removing the upvotes shortly after (thus unboosting PixeL's ratings) . It would look the exact way it does - ratings abuse. That doesn't really make what I did right, but it's at least the context for it. In my list of "pet peeves" I posted in another thread, I said doing anything that negatively effects customer experience pisses me off. I agree that this is one of those things - and I certainly am pissed off at myself for it. I fucked up on that one. I won't deny it. I fell below my standard for a laugh - if that's not abuse, I don't know what is.

Tagging @Temar to address your second point, and @Teroxa so he can be up to date on the change.

EDIT: All ratings have been undone.

 

I'm responding to this since there was a report against Temar- not sure if you guys can go back in chat history, but before I was having a conversation with ekksdee and I used the word "nigga" a couple of times. No one warned me about it, pretty unfair for you guys to just decide what is and isn't racist. Dazza was there but did nothing, most likely because he thought it wasn't racist, but another mod can come in and claim it sounds racist to them and get their admin's discretion to give a warning or w.e it is that you guys do. When I saw Temar warn UncleBee to not be racist, I didn't want to talk in shoutbox anymore because I was scared that he would've seen me use "nigga" and then warn me about it and I didn't want to be warned... even though I didn't agree with how Temar thought UncleBee was being racist. So, what? It just depends on how the person is feeling about it? Each person is going to have their own way of seeing it or defining it, there's no real structure here and mods just getting discretion from their admins is not really fair because both people might view it differently.

Also, since Sticky bandit responded to this and said....some very interesting things. You mention how YOU felt since you have a built a...case? that this is no accident? Right, I've seen your "case files" above with your evidence, but then you mention statistics wheres that at, I dont see any numbers. Then you say black "dudes" are historically most discriminated against? What about black females? It's not just the "dudes." It's obvious that you are very biased about the use of the word "nigga," or rather that you really don't like the use of that word because in the videos you referenced there were some videos that had the "er" in the end when no said it with an er. So I feel like if I used it in front of you, knowing that you don't like the word at all, you can say it's racist then issue me a warning point. Not fair.

And to add on top of this whole use of the word "nigga" and what can be deemed racist or not racist, take a look at the sc below

Spoiler: Owner

Here you had a previous owner use this word, so what is this then? Is this racist in your eyes? Do we need to ask 4 staff members to see if its racist? What if there's a tie, 2 say racist 2 say not racist? Where do we draw the line.

 

yet again, locked until the people who are involved can reply (non staff message me or another staff member if you have anything to add in the mean time)

 

Just to be clear here, I wasn't calling anyone a racist here in this situation. Maybe it's a regional language difference- but I'm saying that the actions here were inherently racist by placing something that is by nature not racist, and attributing it so. Not necessarily that the person in general is racist (which to me, would be someone who purposefully, and repeatedly repeats racist behaviors). I do not believe that neither you, or Sticky Bandit are indeed a racist for this single instance.

Fair enough. I could have seen this one going either way while I do still disagree with it.

Thanks.

You're not addressing my question here, so I'll ask it again.

You know, as well as I, that warnings on SGM have consequences. They are only one step away from getting a ban, sometimes long term. Not only that, but recently, history has been used as a deciding factor on recent punishments, and as this whole thread has shown, these type of warnings have affected TrinityBlade as well. So even though no action farther than a verbal warning has been given, I still feel it is critically important for this to be addressed.

I understand that you felt UncleBee's comment was racist. That doesn't add anything than what is already provided within the screenshots. What I'm asking is for you to explain why this was perceived as racist? What are the contextual clues that led you to believe that UncleBee was being racist in his use of the word nigga... a word UncleBee, and others at SGM use colloquially often. Sticky Bandit did a great job at explaining his side, but you haven't explained yours at all. You just repeated what was already in the screenshots. So.. I ask again. What is it exactly that made UncleBee's usage of the word racist in your judgement?

 

This is so pathetic lol

User warned for this post, don't post unless involved and got something useful to add - Temar

 

tagging @Temar to reply to this, because im still not clear on what made him think i was being "racist"