Invalid Report against Noob999

Discussion in 'TTT Staff/Player Reports' started by neutral, Feb 22, 2019.

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  1. neutral

    neutral Banned VIP

    Name of Staff/Player:
    Noob999
    Steam ID of Staff/Player:
    Staff
    Your Steam ID:
    /shrug
    Which Server:
    Deathrun
    Which Map:
    Forums
    Which Round:
    Forums
    Time of Occurence:
    Earlier today
    Reason For Report:
    This report was improperly handled:
    https://www.seriousgmod.com/threads/report-against-ted.51444/

    While Ted was lucky, and got the correct verdict for the report, it was just that, lucky. The report was not investigated correctly, and with Noob's failure to act on this report correctly, Ted would not receive the guidance necessary to prevent mistakes like this in the future.

    This is another tick in Noob's history of handling reports inappropriately as was stated in this report here: https://www.seriousgmod.com/threads/report-against-temar-noob999.48296/


    Edit:
    After a few mods who disagreed with Noob's verdict messaged me as well after I posted this, I figured I'd elaborate a bit more. Reports have always been a section on the forums to report when staff isn't acting up to par, or incorrectly handling their staffing duties.

    Ted did get the correct verdict on that report after the forum report was made. He saw damage in the damage logs that was unspecific and related to prop damage- in these cases, reviewing the death scene is always critical since prop-damage can come up in the logs in a multitude of ways that isn't even related to the player the logs indicate.

    Instead of this, he took the vague response that Dani had, and somehow appropriated it to him admitting the report- even though that's no way stated in his response. Ted's proper response would have been to question it more. Instead of Ted taking on that responsibility himself, as he is supposed too, he tells Dani that it is Dani's responsibility to ask for the staff member to clarify it.

    All in all, Ted had no proper evidence that an RDM occurred, and slayed a player for it. Noob indicated by marking that report invalid that this was the appropriate course of action.
    Evidence And/Or Witnesses:

     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 25, 2019
  2. ryan

    ryan yeet VIP

  3. Teroxa

    Teroxa Vier Fäuste für ein Halleluja VIP Silver

    Heyo, I'm aware of this report and will finish up once @Noob999 gave his input.
     
  4. Noob999

    Noob999 The best Noob around. VIP

    Hello HelixSpiral.
    Ted did not mishandled the report against Dani.
    We do slay without death scenes for prop damage.
    Sometimes prop damage can be logged to the wrong player but that damage is never as high as 217.
    You can see from the damage logs he was shooting at the same second as the prop damage happen. https://ibb.co/ZcGxNFj
    So it's going to be a goomba stomp.
    Dani response was invalid "what is lut!!!!". He had 3 mins to talk to Ted, before the slay and offer more info and I'm if he did Ted would remove the slay.
    That report looks like just another classic bullshit response from a player who does not care.
    As for asking more questions could of helped getting a clearer view of what happen. Ted is not required to in this case.
    As for info in the staff section. without leaking anything I think you would find you are out of date if you were staff again.
    I always talk to my mods after a forum report to find what could be done better next time.

    I will leave this report to @Teroxa to finish up.
     
  5. neutral

    neutral Banned VIP

    A prop can register that type of damage in a multitude of ways and register to the wrong player.

    Such as a Dani dropping a prop and another player hitting it with another prop.

    Or a discombobulater launching a prop Dani handled.

    But regardless, Goomba stomps can be assigned to the wrong player as well- such as if Dani is pushed off of a ledge with a prop. Then the pusher is responsible. Which is especially likely when Dani is claiming to be AFK.

    I can see a new staff member not realizing this, but a staff member with multiple years on the team not knowing this is concerning

    That is exactly why a death scene is required in these cases unless they admit it- which Dani didn’t do. He stated confusion, and Ted did not investigate further.

    I’m sure staff discussion has changed, but I’m also sure that staff isn’t allowed to slay without proof that an RDM occurred. Staff should investigate further when confusing responses are given- I’m not sure why you’re discounting Dani’s at being a “bullshit response”.
     
  6. neutral

    neutral Banned VIP

    Also-

    I’m not sure why the reason is being given for Ted by you. Ted never mentioned that it HAD to be a Goomba (setting aside that a Goomba may be caused by someone else). Ted specifically said:

    Ted investigated the report as a possibility that prop damaged occurred, so Ted is saying his actions are appropriate in cases where prop damage occurred. Setting aside that prop damage can ABSOLUTEY cause that much damage, Ted is still misinvestigating reports based on his response to Dani’s report- and you said this was okay.
     
  7. Teroxa

    Teroxa Vier Fäuste für ein Halleluja VIP Silver

    Heya, sorry for the delay. I wasn't home over the weekend.

    You can expect my verdict soon.
    I'll leave this unlocked in the meantime if anyone has something else to add.
     
  8. Dani

    Dani Impersonating Staff Banned VIP

    I disagree. My response, which reads "what is iut!!!!!!!!", doesn't look like a "classic bullshit response". It looks like the words "what is it". The u is next to the i on my keyboard and it does not take Sherlock Holmes to figure out that my 4000-hours-on-Gmod-sausage-fingers would hit both keys at the same time. It's interesting that you quoted it as "lut" and not "iut". Does this mean that you misread my report response and couldn't figure out what I meant as a result? I mean, I know you're not the guy who put the slay on me, but you know that you can't slay me for not expressing myself correctly when you're reading the letters wrong, right?

    What did look like "classic bullshit" was the report that was put on me. It was a guy saying "Dani you piece of shit". Why would I have to respond to that? It was apparent that I did not have the information to respond properly or a good reason to take the report seriously in the first place.

    Helix, a guy who seems to care more about this than me, is absolutely right: Ted got the report right, but he got lucky. He objectively handled it wrong and if he had been less lucky OR if I hadn't just outright admitted to it, it would have been a false slay. I could have had reason to damage those two people, and guess what: Nobody ever asked me for those reasons because there wasn't a report on me for it. Only a random insult report, which also happens constantly when I kill innocents as a traitor.

    The fact that you expect me to investigate my own reports because the guy who reported me with malicious intent did not give me the information I needed is fucking absurd. You want me to investigate every weird report that's made against me, fearing that one of them might happen to be marked valid?

    Here's a thread that contains me complaining about this exact type of stuff. Funnily enough, HelixSpiral was also there and agreed with me in the second post.

    Relevant quotes:

    But yeah, it seems like this is totally my fault for being such a classic bullshitter, and not the fault of the person who

    1. Handles a report that insults me and gives me no information
    2. Can't decipher what I said because there's one letter too many in one of the wortds
    3. Makes no effort to find out ANYTHING about the report, not even try to find out a cause of death.
    4. Has an admin who can't tell the difference between an i and an l and finds a way to blame me for it.
    5. Has an admin who expects me to prevent my own slay within 3 minutes by saying that the report isn't giving me information instead of just not putting a slay on me because the report isn't giving anyone any information.

    I get that I misspelled a word, but...really? You're not gonna take just a tiny bit of responsibility?

    tl;dr: You can't slay someone for an invalid response on a report if the report itself isn't a real report in the first place.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2019
  9. Teroxa

    Teroxa Vier Fäuste für ein Halleluja VIP Silver

    Hey there, sorry for the delay.

    I've reviewed the report on Ted again and already had a talk with Noob.
    Furthermore, I've discussed this matter with the rest of the leadership, because I realize that the verdict on this report might have an effect on how players expect the staff team to react under certain circumstances.
    We made sure to come to a mutual agreement before I'd give an official verdict on this report. But enough of that, let's get to the matter at hand:

    As mentioned, I've reviewed the report on Ted, filed by Dani, handled by Noob.
    When it comes to the report itself and the decision Noob reached - which was to reject the report, I agree with Noobs verdict.
    Ted handled the situation appropriately. But let me go into more detail:
    As a staff team, we of course take a great interest, and are always working towards resolving the reports we receive in a reasonable time and reaching the correct solution according to our guidelines.
    Staff members are required to investigate reports. And if the information we find in using our staff resources isn't enough, we investigate further.
    However, we expect that if a player is reported, they give a reasonable response to the report. If you are reported, you are required to respond to the report.
    I realize that sometimes players file reports without the grounds to do so. But this doesn't change the fact that it's still an official report being filed. If you believe you did nothing wrong, or do not know what the report is about, just address that in your response. The staff member will investigate the report and if get back to you if necessary. Usually, the player will have just reported the wrong person or there's another reason that invalidates the report.
    But in a case like this, where there is actually logged damage showing a kill, but the reported player did not appropriately respond to the report, issuing a slay is the correct way to handle the situation.
    As mentioned above, the leadership has reviewed this case, and we agree on thinking that this case didn't absolutely require the DS to reach a verdict.
    Ted handled the situation appropriately by issuing a slay for the report. This means the report on Ted was indeed invalid, which in turn means Noob made the correct decision to reject it.

    One issue I see with the Noobs response to the report is the way it he provided the verdict.
    I think the way he delivered the verdict needs some improvement.
    I've already had a talk with him addressing this and I hope we can improve this in the future.

    I'll be marking this report invalid, as Noob's verdict on the report against Ted was correct.
    If you have any questions, feel free to contact me here or on discord.

    ~ Teroxa
     
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