Why does one hack?

Discussion in 'Off Topic Discussion' started by stakkuu, Apr 28, 2017.

  1. Classical

    Classical He who does not fear death dies only once. Bronze

    Hmm, since ive been away from the community for so long I cant say I have much of an opinion on it.
    Could you explain it in more detail?

    Also one thing I left out is that at the time of my ban, the administration team wanted to only give me a COI and keep it on the DL, I insisted to put the reason for my ban as hacking and nothing else (Im guessing you can figure out why I did this)
     
  2. ZaneLoehr (Masochist Ver.)

    ZaneLoehr (Masochist Ver.) Warehouse 13 Next Generation VIP

    https://www.seriousgmod.com/threads...idence-and-with-intent-disproved.50377/page-2

    Opalium's post on this thread for his reasoning on banning Rice. A short while after Opal left, Rice's ban appeal was accepted.
     
  3. Classical

    Classical He who does not fear death dies only once. Bronze


    As to Opal's anti-cheat system, I know it exists and he didn't make it up, if he wrote the code himself im not sure about that.
    If it detected Rice using a bypass, its 99% sure he was using a script.

    However, there was no evidence disclosed (as was the case for my ban).
    This means one of two things, Opal is lying and there never was any evidence, or the more likely scenario is that he wouldn't disclose the methods to anyone for fear of someone bypassing the AC system.
    Rice was well known and the server is closing down, so after Opal left, any evidence he had he took with him. And that's why Rice got unbanned.

    My guess is that Rice does indeed hack, but without any shred of evidence the ban cannot be upheld.
    Keep in mind this is only from extrapolating what I read, I haven't talked to Rice or Opal.
     
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  4. tz-

    tz- feelin it VIP Emerald

    +1 this is how i felt when i hacked back in like i think 2014 on here

    (p sure opal script is real, dont know if it still is bc opalium yeeted out)
    1. rice was cheating it was obv in one of the demos where he perfectly snaps to the players head, im p sure demos record server-side interactions, not client-side but i might be wrong but we've banned for less.
    2. there's a video of someone spectating you in one of the early staff threads (oops leaking) and i could see that you were hacking back then the way you kinda snapped to people and this was when i lowkey started hacking too so i knew what to look out for
    3. rice was unbanned because supposedly wink never asked for proof from opalium and helix so he just unbanned him, im mad about that btw #fuckwink

    thank you for coming to my ted talk, [​IMG]
     
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  5. 30 tic demo is obviously bad and the fact you still try to use it as proof is hilarious.

    I mean when shots on any 30 tic demo slowed down are doing blood splatters and the player model/crosshair are not lined up it should be obvious enough to not try and use it as proof and get actual good footage if you suspect someone of cheating. It was all just confirmation bias back then, people wanted to see what they wanted to see even though there was 0 evidence.

    Also my thoughts on Opal's anti-cheat.

    1. If it was real, it was false positives. A single guy coding an anti-cheat for a dying game has his anti cheat going off on a player that's willing to work with them and actually streamed the game. (check my twitch if you want hours of gameplay on SGM with actual good footage!) The same guy who has never been banned by any other anti-cheat, yet some of the actual people pushing for my ban back then had multiple vac bans on record. Same guy who posted an endless amount of proof playing at professional levels in multiple different games. But wait, i'm going to cheat on a dying game when the majority of the community mained gmod for all this time and was stuck at the same level of play because they had no other players to better themselves.

    2. Conspiracy thoughts have been that helix/opal faked it because at the time people who consistently donated to the server were threatening to quit if I was allowed to play. So they followed the money. only @Highwon can really answer that. If Opal did not show him the proof as to why ban a person who's been playing on their server off/on since beginning of 2017 then that's pretty sketchy.

    3. Extra thought: but I literally told everyone in the server, and server admins, and on my ban appeal to SPECTATE me. The only thing Opal said his anti-cheat had was when I knew someone was spectating me? Does that make any sense at all? I was begging for people to spectate me. You can hit tab and if 9 players including admins are in spectate and you just got unbanned it's common sense you're getting spectated. Why would the only thing detected be that. It's just stupid logic.

    I'm ban on sight on that other server, but TTT as a whole is declining pretty rapidly from a year ago. Which is sad. TNS and SGM were the best two communities of the TTT genre. Then of course like Saxton Hale killed Arena on TF2, this dumb inventory system kills TTT.


    Wink said when I asked about him unbanning me in the first place he talked with other admins and seen no reason to keep the ban as is. From what it sounds like was that he disagreed with the proof they tried to use. They say he never asked them for it. Opal may have just declined to give him his "proof" or they are just going to stick with their story and run with it on their creation and try to profit off the handful of people who still donate money to gmod servers. They said "it's not our fault if the admins want a "confirmed" hacker in their community". Lol. Confirmed by the "proof" they won't show and a 1 man coded anti-cheat that there's NO WAY would have false positives.

    Either way, it doesn't really matter TTT is pretty much dead and if someone still thinks im hacking you literally need to go play a game where people actually try in and not try so hard in Garry's Mod of all games out there. lol. It's not hard to be good at Gmod and as I always said I played it in-between games because it's just to pass time.
     
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  6. audrey

    audrey batty VIP

    I will point out: Your repeated defense that "why would I hack in a dead game, blah blah" is not really that convincing. The same thing could be said by anyone, but plenty of people still hack in GMod and I'm not inclined to believe you're too special and too good to hack on GMod. I don't know whether you did or did not hack, but either way I suggest you give that condescending silliness a rest.
     

  7. that's not even my main point. My main point has and always will be the bundle of professional level of play on multiple games, my stream highlights, and the fact that people still think 30 tic demos slowed down to 4% are good evidence. It's just funny at this point a handful of players(a very small handful) still go with it even though I got unbanned.

    Other than that, none of my original post was meant to be condescending, sorry it comes across that way.
     
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  8. Iuna

    Iuna Goodnight moon VIP

    ok but who cares
     
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  9. MemeDaddy

    MemeDaddy VIP

    It’s kinda the topic of the thread :thonking:
     
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  10. Classical

    Classical He who does not fear death dies only once. Bronze


    The way you respond to this is quite eye-opening. Especially the boasting godlike gaming skills.


    Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....

     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2018
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  11. ZaneLoehr (Masochist Ver.)

    ZaneLoehr (Masochist Ver.) Warehouse 13 Next Generation VIP

    Rice I love you man but let's talk. Long post incoming but I tried to make it look nice.

    Yes a single guy, but not some random kid who's using his high school textbook to code. These kind of people know what they are doing and the number of people who worked on a piece of code is no real indicator on the quality of the code.

    Irrelevant. That's comparing (at best) the quality of one anti-cheat to another not comparing who cheats and who doesn't.

    BS point. If the server relied on those donations it would be dead years ago, unless you're suggesting the majority of the community were in on those demands. The donations of a few people (even if consistent) would never cause issues to server longevity to the point they would do something like that. Even if they were out for you and were looking for an excuse. You also have guys like Sweer, Jshore, daniel who plays just as good, if not better than you. Why haven't they received similar measures? Especially for players like jshore and Sweer who staff was pretty much looking for the opportunity to ban them. What makes you so special? Did you sleep with Opal's sister or something?

    They were co-owners. If Highwon didn't ask for it, Opal doesn't have to/nor is there a reason to show him.

    Besides the fact there are cheats to show you when someone is spectating you, asking people to spectate you/watch your highlights is not evidence to defend yourself. Anyone can decide to stop cheating, record themselves and pass it off as proof, more so for people who are inherently good at the game, its easier to get away with it in those cases. (Glad Classical is back and giving his input.)

    Difference between "what it sounds like..." and "They say..." Unless he specifically says he disagrees with the proof you can't make it sound like their stories are conflicting.

    See above on the spectate issue. Agree on the the use of demos for evidence but that's not the only way to get evidence. What about recording live footage with Software like Shadowplay, Dxtory and OBS? Wouldn't these give a better representation?

    All in all the only way to determine if someone truly is cheating is by spectating them when they are not aware in hopes of catching them, or via some form of anti-cheat. Which brings me to the last point. Why only you? If this was a one time thing it'd be understandable but how come after getting a second chance do you set off his anti-cheat again given the circumstances he gave. You can argue conspiracy theories for the second and third time you set off the anti-cheat but what would be his incentive for the first time? Why would he lie or try to set you up the first time you set it off? Why not someone like me who's not even that good at the game?

    Now you can argue, "Why would I decide to continue cheating knowing now that there is an anti-cheat and being given a second chance? Well you can take any answer that wasn't about you in this thread and answer that question.

    I enjoy playing with you and hope to see you around still, but given what we know, I just don't agree with the decision to unban you nor do I agree with the counter evidence you've provided. If they did have it out for you and banned you unfairly, well credit to wink for helping you out. Hopefully that answers anything you were unclear about.
     
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  12. I do want to start off with it's nice to have actual discussion about this stuff, unlike before when the ones who wanted me banned would call people retarded or attack those people for defending me while I was banned. Even though none of that matters anymore.


    Just going to do some quick responses, my post won't look as good as yours though. I'll try and enter for each line to kind of show what I'm responding to.

    Fair point on the single guy coding not being a HS textbook. However, if he's the only one looking at the code, then he has no say from others on what could be wrong with said code.

    I don't think the never being banned by a single anti cheat is irrelevant. I would trust companies who are paid to make sure their anti-cheat is working for triple AAA games with much larger communities to have semi-decent anti-cheat.

    You mention Sweer, Jshore, and Daniel. Jshore is just pure toxicity, and Daniel idk I really didn't pay much attention to him. They're above average gmod players who can kill me in-game, but there's still room to grow in their skill level, which is apparent. I'm not some unkillable player and I still do make mistakes in game. Put them in other games that I've shown I been high ranked in(with proof and not just mentioning like this other guy that I keep being compared too) and they won't do nearly as good. Everyone can get better at games, I'm just "arguably" above them. But that's beside the point. Like I said for your "BS point" it was a conspiracy theory at best. Short-sighted and not really meant to be the main point of the original post.

    Co owners with no communication about what they're doing to a player that's been on their server for over a year? Sounds bad to me imo.

    My stream highlights weren't just recording myself and passing it off as proof. It was literally every single session of gameplay i've played. My mistakes, my playstyle, everything. idk who Classical is, nor really care, if he's just going to compare me to some past person who said they were good and never actually posted evidence of being good.

    What wink told me in a steam message and what Helix is saying makes their stories sound conflicting. Either can respond on it though neither have to. but again doesn't really matter at this point.


    And again idk why his anti-cheat was going off on only me. I don't know how it was coded or what it was looking for. Perhaps it was flagging something on my computer as a false positive. I reinstalled Gmod after my first unban and it still got flagged. I have 0 idea on why I was flagged. I can only speculate at this point. I was(and am) still willing to work with him, but he doesn't want me on his server so oh well.


    and this statement you had:

    I won't argue that because I never cheated in the first place :)
     
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  13. Classical

    Classical He who does not fear death dies only once. Bronze

    I have seen the efficiency of the AC system myself. The anti-cheat analyzes the lua code running on Gmod itself. If its simple regular Gmod without any fuckery going on there simply wouldn't have been a detection in the first place.

    Irrelevant indeed. I don't need to explain why this is. Besides whats the proof you haven't been banned in other games? Linking your steam account doesn't mean anything.

    First off I haven't seen your highlights so I cant comment on that. However most cheats available publicly (and those that aren't) allow the user to see spectators. This is how most people who hack in Gmod avoid detection for long periods of time.

    As to who I am, lets just say I know very well what im talking about, everybody who knew me when I was part of the community can attest to this. I'm not comparing you to anyone but I did notice some familiar patterns in the way you defend yourself.


    Lets be clear here, the anti-cheat didn't only go off on you personally, you and most people in this community aren't privy to know how people got banned via this system.

    You aren't a "special" case. It was flagging the lua code you were using, as long as you don't put the lua code in Gmod the AC system wouldn't have detected anything.

    I do commend you on your efforts to save face however. Quite a good show.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2018
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  14. Santa Claus

    Santa Claus Best Member VIP Bronze

    can you guys quit beating each other off and get back on topic lol
     
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  15. Classical

    Classical He who does not fear death dies only once. Bronze

    No it feels too good. Pass the lube please.
     
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  16. UncleBee

    UncleBee VIP

    Hacking has always looked kind of exciting from the movies, but Chuck Wendig begs to differ. In honor of the release of his new novel Zer0es about a team of hackers, Wendig chatted with Bookish about what hacking really entails, and how to make it exhilarating on the page. We don’t believe it, Chuck! We are anything but bored.

    In talking about my upcoming novel, Zer0es, where a group of five wildly different hackers have to band together to go up against a self-aware NSA surveillance system, everyone wants to know if I got hacking “right” or not.

    Because most books and movies and shows get it very, very wrong. Let’s see if this sounds familiar:

    Our Heroes have a problem. The Bad Guys are closing in. They’ve got an attack helicopter and the chopper’s cannon has spun up and seemingly infinite bullets are just chewing apart the walls and roof of the building. Our Heroes include one hacker, and that particular hacker is trying to get a signal from who-knows-where, and ding, he manages it, and then he Begins To Hack. And his hacking looks a lot like he’s just opening and closing windows in some version of Microsoft Windows, and we see maybe a few snippets of code and then—

    A progress bar fills up across the screen. The bar reads HACKING! and it slowly fills up as the bullets begin to tear apart the room. The bar fills, fills, fills, 25%, 40%, 67%… and then, zing! The HACKING! bar reaches 100% and the hacker has somehow hacked the helicopter and the helicopter explodes. Boom.

    I’m oversimplifying, I get it, but that’s often how fiction treats the act of hacking: by oversimplifying it. Which is true about a lot of things, one supposes, whether it’s discharging a weapon or training to be a spy. Facts fall prey to entertainment. You don’t want something on the page or on the screen that looks, well, boring.

    And that’s the problem with writing the act of hacking—not writing about hacking, and not writing about the consequences of hacking, but actually describing the act (and some might say the art) of hacking: It’s incredibly dull.

    It involves, unsurprisingly, a whole lot of sitting around at keyboards and typing things into keyboards. You code. You use software. You code some more. It’s about as interesting as watching someone log their daily caloric intake into a spreadsheet. Hell, it’d be about as interesting as watching me write a book about hacking.

    So, when people ask how accurate the hacking in my book, I have to give a vigorous shrug. I didn’t go for factual. I went for authentic. And here’s what I mean by that: In fiction, something does not have to be true. It just has to feel that way.

    It is our job as authors to convince you that the thing we are writing is a True Thing whether or not it’s true. It must feel accurate, not be accurate. The dinosaurs in both the film of Jurassic Park are not scientifically accurate representations of dinosaurs. But Michael Crichton and Steven Spielberg worked very hard to make them feel accurate, right? They feel authentic to the world and the world gives us details (via the storytelling) to backup the authenticity. It’s the fine art of combining actual facts with stuff we made up to make the story better. It’s a little bit of a magic trick, actually:We distract and misdirect with genuine information while, with our other hand, we spin a web of pure fiction.

    With Zer0es, my goal was then to capture the spirit of hacking and make it feel true to form without having the main characters spend 300 pages sitting around and vigorously typing things. I wanted to acknowledge that, yes, it takes a lot of time at the computer, but I also wanted the results of that time to be interesting, compelling, exciting. And the personalities of the characters involved amp up the drama implicit in the act of hacking—so, it becomes less about the ritual act of the hack and more about the hackers themselves, and the results of their efforts.

    Chuck Wendig is the author of the Miriam Black thrillers (which begin with Blackbirds) and numerous other works across books, comics, games, and more. A finalist for the John W. Campbell Award for Best New Writer and the cowriter of the Emmy-nominated digital narrative Collapsus, he is also known for his popular blog, terribleminds.com. He lives in Pennsylvania with his family.


    copy pasted this from: https://www.bookish.com/articles/chuck-wendig-hacking-is-actually-kind-of-boring/
     
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  17. Dani

    Dani Impersonating Staff Banned VIP

    [​IMG]
     
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  18. UncleBee

    UncleBee VIP

    [​IMG]
     
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  19. "save face"

    Don't really need to save face, but maybe some shred of common sense will get through people who still think I cheat. I mean the admin that banned me who posted the demo evidence used a hidden round where I was tracking an invisible player, even though he was using his mic, as part of their "public proof". Does that really sound like a handful of people who know what they're doing?

    "lets just say I know very well what im talking about"

    totes because I need a spectator detection program when I'm literally streaming my game on twitch. My ban shifted from aimbot at the beginning(which is what I was accused of to start) to "oh he just has a spectator cheat".

    Idk why I am even responding though, but it's funny at this point. Even if your logic makes 0 sense people still run with it. Conformity I guess.


    ooh also it's funny that a lot of the people that think I cheat have vac bans on record
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2018
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  20. Robyn

    Robyn Floof Moderator VIP Silver

    Tagging @wink since he has been mentioned many times.
     
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